Thanks for the overview, Chad. I first became interested in the double Oswald scenario when I read Richard Popkin's book. I think the double Oswalds and whatever happened in Mexico City are the keys to solving the Oswald mystery. I do not believe Lee Harvey Oswald ever went to Mexico City. I agree with Armstrong's assessment that Oswald never shot Tippitt or Kennedy. I never heard about the elevator theory before, but didn't the police discover a British rifle on top of the Texas Book Depository? There are a lot of intriguing things about the Armstrong book. The military intelligence photographer in Dallas that fateful day leads me to believe that Kennedy's murder was planned by operatives of multiple government agencies beyond the CIA. The double Oswald families theory is intriguing and I know that the FBI visited several elementary schools to track down Oswald's records, but it is mind bowing if true that two Oswalds were groomed since their childhood. LHO did have a cousin in the CIA, but I know little about the dobbleganger. I wish researchers would move beyond the CIA and FBI to see what they could uncover in the military and naval intelligence.
Yes, a British Enfield (.303) was reported to have been found on the roof of the TSBD. The guy who brought Oswald to work on 11/22 owned a British Enfield. I'm unaware of any follow up on or any explanation for that rifle. The alleged assassin's rifle was initially reported to have been a German Mauser as revealed by at least two police officers on the scene. The Carcano later held high for photos by a police officer is obviously not the same rifle as the one in the backyard photos because the sling mounts are not the same. Too damn many rifles.
Many Hungarians sided with Hitler as the lesser evil. At the end of the war the Red Army came from the east and Hungarians facing vengeance fled west. The most active needed badly to defect to the west. A couple of the Murrets were in Europe in the OSS, and the chances are about 99.9999% they had to have been the ones who spotted a dead ringer for Marguerite's little boy. That was an immediate ticket into Allen Dulles's OSS twins project, thence to Angleton and Wisner in the CIA.
The boy must have done well learning English, they found a fake mother for him, and by 1947 the two were living in Benbrook, Texas near the real Oswalds-- learning how to be pretend Oswalds. Brother Robert was in on it from the beginning, but not John Pic. Which is why Robert never was nice to Rachel and June with birthdays or Christmas presents. Also why John Pic was not allowed to LHO graveside services to notice Marguerite on TV was not Marguerite his mother. John Pic got to see fake Hungarian Oswald for the first time in 9 years at the 1962 Thanksgiving in Fort Worth. None of the Marguerites were there to avoid confusion. It was Robert at home testing John Pic to see if he could spot the Hungarian was a different person. Nope, he swallowed it hook, line, and sinker. The only thing that puzzled him was that Lee used to call him brother but was now calling him half-brother.
Jackie Ow, when are you going to write a book? Or have you already? Not being sarcastic in anyway, shape or form. If I had to camp out overnight to get it, I would. I read every comment you write wherever I can find it.
Mr. Nagle, this is awesome. Might you someday comment on the two "Prayer Man" books and detailed YouTube video of the topic that Oswald is actually seen out from of TSBD in the Darnell film? Thank you for all your great posts and efforts.
1- As soon as Tippit was shot, everybody ran away in panic but the few like Domingo Benavides who came to help and call in the shooting. But one guy who was different casually observed from across the street until Tippit got his head shot. Then the observer calmly walked over to PP4537 and drove off. This car belonged to radio expert Carl Mather, who had wired LBJ's Air Force Two for radio and navigation high-tech electronics. He just happened to live in the same neighborhood as Tippit and Roscoe White, who were across the street from one another so White could keep an eye on Tippit while he was helping arrange safe houses for assassination participants. Tippit had a mistress to take care of at Tenth and Patton, and so needed extra income. Chances are the PP4537 Mather car was outfitted with similar equipment. We know from Helen Markham that Tippit was shot at 1:06pm. We know from deputy Roger Craig inside the book depository he heard about Tippit at 1:06pm. He checked his watch twice. There weren't any phones where Roger Craig was and cell phones weren't invented yet. It is obvious the guy in PP4537 was on duty to radio TSBD to let them know they had their pretext for peeling cops away from Dealey Plaza and on toward Oak Cliff. A missing doggie or late library book wasn't enough of an excuse. But then again, it would be too obvious to have such communications going directly to a police radio receiver that would be out of place at TSBD. Hmmm........ Hmmmmmm....... I wonder.And how did word spread to the book depository by 1:06pm when Benavides from Tippit's car to DPD dispatch didn't get the word broadcast about Tippit until 1:20? There is something funny going on here.
2- More specifically, Zapruder had his offices on fourth floor Dal-Tex across the street. His top secretary Jeanne LeGon had already married George de Mohrenschildt in 1959 before Oswald was back from Russia to be babysat by de Mohrenschildt. About eleven on Nov. 22, Zapruder started encouraging people in his office "Everybody out, everybody out! We all have a presidential parade to go see! Everybody out!" And they were gone by 11:45am since JFK was supposed to be there by noon. This was the perfect spot to set up Assassination Command Central, since it overlooked almost all of Dealey Plaza and the various sniper positions. It also was in touch with the roof of Central Records and sixth floor TSBD by hand signals. It was also the perfect place from which to film JFK coming from Main onto Houston, all the way face first down Houston, taking the lazy turn onto Elm, then leaving on Elm. Twice as much footage, and better footage, than standing on a pedestal down the street, fighting crowds and weather, and having to be held up by a secretary to avoid tottering over and breaking your neck. But Zapruder had an assassination to film, not a parade, and for insurance Babushka Lady was opposite in case Zapruder's camera failed. She never stepped forward for her thousands of dollars of film payola and fame with her fortune, since she was there on the CIA's dime along with the still photographer standing to the right rear of Altgens who was at the curb. Babushka Lady's film ended up at the Green Beret sniper assassination training school at Ft. Bragg, North Carolina. After it was seen by Dan Marvin's class, the instructor advised "This is an excellent example of how to conduct a perfect urban sniper assassination." Later the CIA at Ft. Bragg asked Dan Marvin to kill Lt. Cmdr. William Bruce Pitzer because he had an untampered video of the highly faked JFK autopsy. Dan Marvin declined but somebody else didn't.
3- Putting it all together, the deep state planners needed angry hornet cops to come near Oswald once he was planted in the Texas Theater. Expecting his ride and plane trip to CIA hero paradise after a sham assassination gesture upon JFK like Oswald was trained with Gen Walker. A sacrificed Tippit would do for the macro excuse, and then an Oswald imposter not paying and hiding upstairs would be the big deal $1.25 unpaid ticket that got the cops exactly to Oswald's location. After four or five different phone calls kept asking the cops to come to Texas Theater. Oswald was eating his popcorn by about 1:05pm, so the coast was clear to shoot Tippit at 1:06pm. That's when Westbrook left his detective car in the back alley and walked down the driveway toward Tippit. That was his signal to come out and get his last-minute instructions about killing Oswald and becoming a big hero with book and movie deals. Tippit always put his hat on when he exited his car, then snugged it front and back. So when his arms and elbows were predictably up high to provide a clear shot that's when he got it three times in the chest. Not enough, so Westbrook instructed the gunman for the head shot. For his efforts, Ed Lansdale gave Westbrook a cushy CIA job in Saigon, training South Vietnamese police. Probably to set up the Phoenix Program.
4- Understanding the rest of the story, we can see how the observer across the street must have called in the mission accomplished story to Zapruder's office radio, pulled out of a filing cabinet shortly after noon and with frequency-hopping features. Likely from Jack Crichton's 488th Military Intelligence Detachment in Dallas. Crichton wanted JFK dead and Castro gone so he could get back into millions of dollars of oil drilling in the eastern half of Cuba. Once a Zapruder-location Dal-Tex member of Assassination Command Central got the mission accomplished message from PP4537, his Dal-Tex hand signal across Houston to sixth floor TSBD would have let the anxious cops know it was time to roll and go kill Oswald for the next act in the evolving melodrama. Now guys like John Liggett could get a good night's sleep with no worries.
5- The Dallas cops had been at the Texas Theater that morning about 6:30am, shoving aside janitor Tom Bowden so they could learn the dance steps for their pending matinee performance. Where were the rooms and hallways and passages to goose Oswald out into the back alley. Where Roger Craig saw Dallas police with guns drawn waiting to intercept Oswald as he ran out back. They were led there by a pal of Jack Ruby, and another pal of Jack Ruby had repeatedly called the police to the theater after Julia Postal's timid one effort. The mechanism was to approach Oswald slowly from the front, scare him into running out back, and then he could be shot in the back indoors if possible, or more confidently done in in the back alley. Just like John Dillinger, after Oswald had earlier been induced to run off like John Wilkes Booth from the scene of the crime. Sam Giancana was from Chicago after all, and the Nov. 2 plot had almost been pulled off there with only a last-minute cancellation. So we have a clue how Thomas Arthur Vallee would have been done in on his way to a CIA hero retirement. On this occasion though, Oswald for once spotted a set-up, and so stayed in his chair shouting "I am not resisting arrest! I am not resisting arrest!" Ruby would have to wait until Sunday to earn his $50,000 and movie and book deals. He would be a hero, and with a good lawyer like pro-bono altruistic Melvin Belli be sure to get off for time served. Right. Oswald, Tippit, and Ruby all didn't know the difference between hero and patsified fall guy.
6- The other Oswald came in to the theater after Hungarian sacrificial Oswald, didn't pay, created that pretext, and hid upstairs. After Hungarian Oswald was taken out the front, and his arrest astonished the police radio dispatcher who expected Oswald to be dead, then upstairs Oswald was brought down to the police car in the back alley with a jacket over his head so people like the concession stand operator couldn't figure what was going on. He was hustled into a black and white and driven off. Soon to be released a block or two away where he was soon seen behind the wheel of PP4537 by mechanic T.F. White. Then he was flown to New Mexico in a CIA C-54 cargo plane along with Air Force Sergeant Robert Vinson. And a guy who looked a lot like David Sanchez Morales who was later eliminated when convenient with a double dose of ricin.
7- Mark Groubert of America's Untold stories did a lot of leg work about the cast-off Oswald jacket tossed under a car. It turns out it had a laundry tag from a cleaning service in Larry Crafard's home base town in California. And he had bought an identical copy. It appears Westbrook was the one who went to the area to plant the jacket evidence.
Pitch it to Netflix. It would be far better than most of their productions which are plagued by bad writing.
So it was the Hungarian Oswald who was the radar operator in Japan, who was the fake defector who spoke Russian like a native, befriended Titovets, and who returned to the US with Marina while the real Oswald stayed in New Orleans training anti-Castro Cuban fighters and ordering military hardware for them?
That's a very pertinent question. I read up on this issue and found a few facts that cast doubt on the official version of the exhumation. I did a Quora post about it here:
There might (should) be some tissue saved from the autopsy. If so, this controversy could be resolved by DNA. I say this after watching many hours of Bloodline Detectives where decades old murders have been solved in the last few years through genetic genealogy. I think one unknown murder victim was identified after 50 or 60 years because tissue had been saved from the victim's autopsy (on a slide, I think).
I don’t know. Maybe he knew his real brother was alive and working undercover, and he was incentivized to go along with the gag. It does seem far-fetched, but it resonates at the same time.
I've always thought David Lynch could do a great take on this. He's got a thing for doppelgängers. They appear in at least 3 of his movies plus the Twin Peaks series.
The fake Hungarian Oswald and his fake Marguerite mother moved in to 101 San Saba in Benbrook, Texas on July 7, 1947. They were installed about 4 blocks from the real Oswalds, and their jobs were to teach the fakes how to be Oswalds and for the fakes the job was to learn how to be Oswalds. Both sets moved in parallel to New York and New Orleans at various times, and it was all about cultivating the Hungarian as a twin. The fake mama had more of a New York accent than a New Orleans accent, where she supposedly was from. Robert was in on the deal from the beginning, and ultimately lined up the Hungarian to be sacrificed to the deep state machine.
Why these arrangements? Most likely because all these people got aventurous exciting jobs and were paid to do what they enjoyed doing. The adult Hungarian Oswald fakers under another name most likely came from anti-communist stock fleeing the Red Army at the end of WWII. So the father and uncle were paid to be pretend commies and spy for the US Government when they got to the Connecticut-New York area. Son Lee from Hungary bought into that flavor of patriotism and related pride, so he was on board mentally with the CIA since he was about kindergarten age. The Oswald born in New Orleans had a family military background including John Pic the half-brother and Robert the brother. So, when such a person is told he has the chance to be a real-life James Bond, earn money outsmarting the bad guys, and puff his head among the elite, few would say no.
He just didn't figure out until late in the game that he was on the list of expendables. Like Dee Dee Myers left Clinton's White House not realizing there was a Raven Rock nuclear bunker to go to but she wasn't on that invite list. Robert was selling out the Hungarian, not his flesh and blood. I highly doubt the real Oswald was killed and put in the casket. They had to keep the real Oswald alive to keep brother Robert happy and quiet, and he didn't die until 2017. Plus, to the select elites, seeing the real Oswald around your CIA spook retirement community in Paraguay means the CIA supervisors are trustworthy honorable people, and you can recommend the spy game to your children and grandchildren, with all the camaraderie and esprit de corps of more generations of heroic patriotic achievement. Which is also probably why Ruth Paine was never fed to the wolves.
We know they ginned up the Ralph Yates pickup truck ride to frame Oswald. Then they decided it was unneeded overkill, so Yates was locked up in the nuthouse and died young. There was all the trouble to frame Oswald in Mexico City, and then LBJ didn't want an extra war in Cuba or Russia. So that extra story was quashed. We know the body exhumed in 1981 wasn't the Hungarian Oswald, because the skull was intact. We know it wasn't the New Orleans Oswald because the teeth were intact. So what? To the CIA getting hold of a third corpse is a piece of cake. They just bungled the job, like they bungled a shot from the front into penetrating the windshield, or like they bungled and left behind on sixth floor a Mauser instead of a Mannlicher-Carcano. We already know from Ralph Yates and Robert Vinson and T.F. White and a dozen other doppelganger citings that there were multiple Oswalds. Another episode underground with embalming fluid is just par for the course.
Was it the Hungarian Oswald who was the radar operator in Japan, who was the fake defector who spoke Russian like a native, befriended Titovets, and who returned to the US with Marina while the real Oswald stayed in New Orleans training anti-Castro Cuban fighters and ordering military hardware for them?
Was Marina in on the whole thing? Was she sleeping with both the real Oswald and the Hungarian Oswald?
Yes, after Hungarian Oswald and Roscoe White finished up their false flag training at the School of Illusionary Warfare near Nag's Head NC, they were on the same boat to Japan. Oswald stayed at Atsugi and Roscoe went on to the Philippines. Yes re Russian skills, Titovets, and marrying Marina. The two Oswalds were in southern California simultaneously in the Marines, but at different bases. The real Oswald would likely help with the Cuban exile training in Louisiana but I haven't read about that. For the Nov. 2 plot in Chicago, Thomas Arthur Vallee had a New York plates car registered to Lee Harvey Oswald, so chances are the American Oswald spent time in New York working with Cuban exiles.
I doubt Marina knew anything. Considering their marital strife the CIA would have screened that out ahead of time and regarded her as too much of a security risk to be brought into the spy game. So Marina is likely random noise. Notice that in 1965 she married Porter, an employee of Collins Radio, and the probability is that he was assigned to watch her as a loose cannon unknown and thus requiring ongoing observation. Collins also provided a raiding boat called the Rex to the CIA for dropping exile teams on Cuban shores. Their Carl Mather lived in the same neighborhood as Tippit with Roscoe White watching him from across the street. Carl Mather had put Collins radios and navigation equipment aboard LBJ's Air Force Two, so he was a team player. After American Oswald was taken out the back of the theater to be smuggled away, T.F. White saw the American Oswald behind the wheel of Mather's car PP4537. Collins radios on loan from Jack Crichton's 488th Military Intelligence Detachment were likely used for their secret frequency hopping features to coordinate chess moves on Nov. 22.
Such as announcing Tippit's ambush death via Dal-Tex to sixth floor TSBD, so they knew it was time to roll pretext cops to Oak Cliff so they next could be sent to the Texas Theater over a big deal ticket unpaid by the real Oswald. He walked in without paying and hid upstairs in the mezzanine. Specifically, when Tippit was shot most people ran away and a few ran towards, to help. Meanwhile one peculiar guy stood there watching from across the street. Only when Tippit got his coup de grace shot to the head did the passive observer walk calmly away. To PP4537, probably to call in Tippit's death on schedule io the cops waiting for it in TSBD. The radio message would have gone first to Assassination Command Central in Zapruder's offices at fourth floor Dal-Tex, then relayed across the street to TSBD by hand signals. Helen Markham on her way to work knew Tippit was shot at 1:06pm. Roger Craig at sixth floor TSBD heard about Tippit being shot at 1:06pm. No cell phones then and no wall phones at sixth floor TSBD, so radio relayed messaging must have been how the news got so fast from Tippit's ambush to the cops being told to roll to Oak Cliff.
Between 11am and noon, Zapruder was walking around his office space encouraging "Everybody out, everybody out! We all have a presidential parade to go see! Everybody out!" Other than one selected secretary (his Jeanne LeGon had been married to George de Mohrenschildt in 1959) everybody was out by 11:45am. Dal-Tex offices were perfect to film JFK coming around the Main St. corner onto Houston, full frontal filming all the way down Houston, the lazy turn onto Elm with JFK on the Dal-Tex side of the camera work, and then his exit down Elm. Twice as much film as what Zapruder got by balancing on a pedestal, held up by a secretary so he didn't lose his balance and break his neck. He was there to film an assassination, not a presidential visit. Babushka Lady was across the street in case his camera needed backing up. It didn't, so this CIA operative not there for fame or fortune deposited her version with the Green Beret sniper assassination training class at Ft. Bragg NC. There is was seen by Dan Marvin and his training class. Once over and the lights came up, the instructor said, "This is an excellent example of how to conduct a perfect urban sniper assassination." Later the CIA at Ft. Bragg asked Dan Marvin to kill Lt. Cmdr. William Bruce Pitzer. Because he had a complete and untampered video of the faked JFK autopsy, and it could not see the light of day. Nor the blackmail the admirals were doing to autopsy doctors Humes and Boswell. Marvin refused to kill Pitzer, so somebody else did.
The 488th was under Jack Crichton, who needed JFK and Castro dead so he could resume big oil operations in the eastern half of Cuba. The real Oswald was reputedly homosexual and therefore fit right in behind the scenes at Jack Ruby's Carousel Club with George Senator, Larry Crafard, Jack Lawrence, and all the rest. So Marina would hardly be two-timing the one Oswald with the other. She had been date-raped back in Russia before meeting LHO, and for some reason didn't seem to be a hard-core floozy. Just a girlfriend of Oswald and an occasional other CIA plant. Of course Marina would be able to tell the two Oswalds apart, but I would guess she wasn't told about the second Oswald so that she couldn't leak the information in case she was from the KGB. One Oswald had blue eyes, the other brown. One was left-handed, the other right-handed. At Beauregard Jr High School Ed Voebel knew both but had no clue he was facing two different Oswalds at the same school. But he must have remembered some discrepancy and started talking about it, because he died at age 31 in 1971 after getting sick (aided or unaided) and going to the Ochsner Clinic.
As to Tippit, remember that Earlene Roberts looked out from the Beckley rooming house and saw two cops in the car when they tapped the horn twice for Oswald. Tippit hadn't been able to pick up Oswald at the Gloco gas station when he changed plans, and when Tippit heard from Westbrook Oswald wasn't on the bus he rushed to the record store only to not connect. That probably was when Earlene Roberts got the call from a friend to turn on her TV for the JFK news. Still in his big panic, Tippit must have gone directly to Beckley to get Hungarian Oswald, and picked him up for the trip to the theater from the Zangs bus-stop across the street.
Then there's the stray police shirt tossed in the back of Tippit's car. Found after he was taken to Methodist Hospital to be pronounced dead. It starts to sound like Tippit's companion was actually a civilian with a cop shirt on for appearances' sake. If you are a hit planner and you don't know where Oswald will end up, but you do know Tippit will be sent (he thinks) to kill Oswald for the fame and book deals, you need an agent of death with Tippit while he is driving around. So that if Oswald bolts and runs and Tippit can track him down, why as soon as sucker cop gets close the magic code words come over the radio. That way the guy wearing the cop shirt can blow away Tippit on a customized job to order basis.
It only happens near Oswald, Tippit's death anywhere is the pretext to fetch cops out of Dealey Plaza since a missing doggie or late library book won't do. And a guy looking like Oswald with Hungarian Oswald near makes it easy to screw the patsy. What a deal we have for you! So there is a fair chance Tippit and his friend dropped Oswald off near the theater, then went to Tenth and Patton for last-minute instructions from Westbrook about blowing away Oswald back at the theater. All Tippit had to do was drop the guy off half a block away from Tenth and Patton, he would walk the short distance to Westbrook's car for a ride back downtown, and everything would be fine for Tippit's pending performance. They just didn't tell him what it would really be.
I definitely buy the Craford/Ruby responsibility for the Tippit shooting based on the Mark Groubert research which also is consistent with great witness Acquilla Clemons. I don’t know what to make of the Lee and Harvey storyline. Clearly there were numerous impersonations but the complexity of the Hungarian Oswald and Marguerite and which family members knew and how the LHO arrest played out seems too complex to be believed. Sure would be nice if there were not so many mysteries/holes surrounding LHO’s movements following the assassination or of the infamous Mexico City trip. I’m anxious with anticipation we could learn something new in the near future.
Does anyone know if there is any truth to the rumor that photos exist of Curtis Laverne “Larry” Craford (friend/employee of Jack Ruby who fled Dallas post assassination, allegedly saying they weren’t going to pin the assssination on him) wearing that lighter colored Eisenhower-style jacket? I believe people have considered him to be a suspect in the Tippett murder along with Ruby, but I can’t find the images. Could be nonsense but curious if anyone has ever looked into it? I believe I also read the Los Angeles-based dry cleaner receipt found in the jacket points to him as he had lived in LA? Any info or thoughts would be appreciated!
Off-topic. A new interview with a USS Liberty survivor was just posted on Redacted. This incident shares a lot in common with the JFK assassination in terms of secrecy and coverup except a lot of the people are still alive. No Congress has had the courage to even open an investigation. Why? Maybe for the same reasons the CIA won't release the JFKA papers. It might reveal who really controls the country.
When I first heard this story, I thought it was the pinnacle of tinfoil hat theories. The more I read about it, the more credible it becomes.
Who goes to a rifle range, makes a conspicuous ass of himself and then announces himself using first, middle, and last names? Who introduces themselves by their full name? No one.
Is it the same person in the two photos at the top of the article?
I don't think the original theory is correct in all details. For example, IIRC, the.body buried in Oswald's grave was exhumed for identity purposes, and it was confirmed that the corpse was that of the real Lee Harvey Oswald. In other words, hasn't it already been proven that the real LHO was murdered by Ruby, not the imposter?
Thanks for the overview, Chad. I first became interested in the double Oswald scenario when I read Richard Popkin's book. I think the double Oswalds and whatever happened in Mexico City are the keys to solving the Oswald mystery. I do not believe Lee Harvey Oswald ever went to Mexico City. I agree with Armstrong's assessment that Oswald never shot Tippitt or Kennedy. I never heard about the elevator theory before, but didn't the police discover a British rifle on top of the Texas Book Depository? There are a lot of intriguing things about the Armstrong book. The military intelligence photographer in Dallas that fateful day leads me to believe that Kennedy's murder was planned by operatives of multiple government agencies beyond the CIA. The double Oswald families theory is intriguing and I know that the FBI visited several elementary schools to track down Oswald's records, but it is mind bowing if true that two Oswalds were groomed since their childhood. LHO did have a cousin in the CIA, but I know little about the dobbleganger. I wish researchers would move beyond the CIA and FBI to see what they could uncover in the military and naval intelligence.
Yes, a British Enfield (.303) was reported to have been found on the roof of the TSBD. The guy who brought Oswald to work on 11/22 owned a British Enfield. I'm unaware of any follow up on or any explanation for that rifle. The alleged assassin's rifle was initially reported to have been a German Mauser as revealed by at least two police officers on the scene. The Carcano later held high for photos by a police officer is obviously not the same rifle as the one in the backyard photos because the sling mounts are not the same. Too damn many rifles.
Or shooters!
Many Hungarians sided with Hitler as the lesser evil. At the end of the war the Red Army came from the east and Hungarians facing vengeance fled west. The most active needed badly to defect to the west. A couple of the Murrets were in Europe in the OSS, and the chances are about 99.9999% they had to have been the ones who spotted a dead ringer for Marguerite's little boy. That was an immediate ticket into Allen Dulles's OSS twins project, thence to Angleton and Wisner in the CIA.
The boy must have done well learning English, they found a fake mother for him, and by 1947 the two were living in Benbrook, Texas near the real Oswalds-- learning how to be pretend Oswalds. Brother Robert was in on it from the beginning, but not John Pic. Which is why Robert never was nice to Rachel and June with birthdays or Christmas presents. Also why John Pic was not allowed to LHO graveside services to notice Marguerite on TV was not Marguerite his mother. John Pic got to see fake Hungarian Oswald for the first time in 9 years at the 1962 Thanksgiving in Fort Worth. None of the Marguerites were there to avoid confusion. It was Robert at home testing John Pic to see if he could spot the Hungarian was a different person. Nope, he swallowed it hook, line, and sinker. The only thing that puzzled him was that Lee used to call him brother but was now calling him half-brother.
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Jackie Ow, when are you going to write a book? Or have you already? Not being sarcastic in anyway, shape or form. If I had to camp out overnight to get it, I would. I read every comment you write wherever I can find it.
No time soon. Too busy reading. Thanks for the comment.
Mr. Nagle, this is awesome. Might you someday comment on the two "Prayer Man" books and detailed YouTube video of the topic that Oswald is actually seen out from of TSBD in the Darnell film? Thank you for all your great posts and efforts.
1- As soon as Tippit was shot, everybody ran away in panic but the few like Domingo Benavides who came to help and call in the shooting. But one guy who was different casually observed from across the street until Tippit got his head shot. Then the observer calmly walked over to PP4537 and drove off. This car belonged to radio expert Carl Mather, who had wired LBJ's Air Force Two for radio and navigation high-tech electronics. He just happened to live in the same neighborhood as Tippit and Roscoe White, who were across the street from one another so White could keep an eye on Tippit while he was helping arrange safe houses for assassination participants. Tippit had a mistress to take care of at Tenth and Patton, and so needed extra income. Chances are the PP4537 Mather car was outfitted with similar equipment. We know from Helen Markham that Tippit was shot at 1:06pm. We know from deputy Roger Craig inside the book depository he heard about Tippit at 1:06pm. He checked his watch twice. There weren't any phones where Roger Craig was and cell phones weren't invented yet. It is obvious the guy in PP4537 was on duty to radio TSBD to let them know they had their pretext for peeling cops away from Dealey Plaza and on toward Oak Cliff. A missing doggie or late library book wasn't enough of an excuse. But then again, it would be too obvious to have such communications going directly to a police radio receiver that would be out of place at TSBD. Hmmm........ Hmmmmmm....... I wonder.And how did word spread to the book depository by 1:06pm when Benavides from Tippit's car to DPD dispatch didn't get the word broadcast about Tippit until 1:20? There is something funny going on here.
2- More specifically, Zapruder had his offices on fourth floor Dal-Tex across the street. His top secretary Jeanne LeGon had already married George de Mohrenschildt in 1959 before Oswald was back from Russia to be babysat by de Mohrenschildt. About eleven on Nov. 22, Zapruder started encouraging people in his office "Everybody out, everybody out! We all have a presidential parade to go see! Everybody out!" And they were gone by 11:45am since JFK was supposed to be there by noon. This was the perfect spot to set up Assassination Command Central, since it overlooked almost all of Dealey Plaza and the various sniper positions. It also was in touch with the roof of Central Records and sixth floor TSBD by hand signals. It was also the perfect place from which to film JFK coming from Main onto Houston, all the way face first down Houston, taking the lazy turn onto Elm, then leaving on Elm. Twice as much footage, and better footage, than standing on a pedestal down the street, fighting crowds and weather, and having to be held up by a secretary to avoid tottering over and breaking your neck. But Zapruder had an assassination to film, not a parade, and for insurance Babushka Lady was opposite in case Zapruder's camera failed. She never stepped forward for her thousands of dollars of film payola and fame with her fortune, since she was there on the CIA's dime along with the still photographer standing to the right rear of Altgens who was at the curb. Babushka Lady's film ended up at the Green Beret sniper assassination training school at Ft. Bragg, North Carolina. After it was seen by Dan Marvin's class, the instructor advised "This is an excellent example of how to conduct a perfect urban sniper assassination." Later the CIA at Ft. Bragg asked Dan Marvin to kill Lt. Cmdr. William Bruce Pitzer because he had an untampered video of the highly faked JFK autopsy. Dan Marvin declined but somebody else didn't.
3- Putting it all together, the deep state planners needed angry hornet cops to come near Oswald once he was planted in the Texas Theater. Expecting his ride and plane trip to CIA hero paradise after a sham assassination gesture upon JFK like Oswald was trained with Gen Walker. A sacrificed Tippit would do for the macro excuse, and then an Oswald imposter not paying and hiding upstairs would be the big deal $1.25 unpaid ticket that got the cops exactly to Oswald's location. After four or five different phone calls kept asking the cops to come to Texas Theater. Oswald was eating his popcorn by about 1:05pm, so the coast was clear to shoot Tippit at 1:06pm. That's when Westbrook left his detective car in the back alley and walked down the driveway toward Tippit. That was his signal to come out and get his last-minute instructions about killing Oswald and becoming a big hero with book and movie deals. Tippit always put his hat on when he exited his car, then snugged it front and back. So when his arms and elbows were predictably up high to provide a clear shot that's when he got it three times in the chest. Not enough, so Westbrook instructed the gunman for the head shot. For his efforts, Ed Lansdale gave Westbrook a cushy CIA job in Saigon, training South Vietnamese police. Probably to set up the Phoenix Program.
4- Understanding the rest of the story, we can see how the observer across the street must have called in the mission accomplished story to Zapruder's office radio, pulled out of a filing cabinet shortly after noon and with frequency-hopping features. Likely from Jack Crichton's 488th Military Intelligence Detachment in Dallas. Crichton wanted JFK dead and Castro gone so he could get back into millions of dollars of oil drilling in the eastern half of Cuba. Once a Zapruder-location Dal-Tex member of Assassination Command Central got the mission accomplished message from PP4537, his Dal-Tex hand signal across Houston to sixth floor TSBD would have let the anxious cops know it was time to roll and go kill Oswald for the next act in the evolving melodrama. Now guys like John Liggett could get a good night's sleep with no worries.
5- The Dallas cops had been at the Texas Theater that morning about 6:30am, shoving aside janitor Tom Bowden so they could learn the dance steps for their pending matinee performance. Where were the rooms and hallways and passages to goose Oswald out into the back alley. Where Roger Craig saw Dallas police with guns drawn waiting to intercept Oswald as he ran out back. They were led there by a pal of Jack Ruby, and another pal of Jack Ruby had repeatedly called the police to the theater after Julia Postal's timid one effort. The mechanism was to approach Oswald slowly from the front, scare him into running out back, and then he could be shot in the back indoors if possible, or more confidently done in in the back alley. Just like John Dillinger, after Oswald had earlier been induced to run off like John Wilkes Booth from the scene of the crime. Sam Giancana was from Chicago after all, and the Nov. 2 plot had almost been pulled off there with only a last-minute cancellation. So we have a clue how Thomas Arthur Vallee would have been done in on his way to a CIA hero retirement. On this occasion though, Oswald for once spotted a set-up, and so stayed in his chair shouting "I am not resisting arrest! I am not resisting arrest!" Ruby would have to wait until Sunday to earn his $50,000 and movie and book deals. He would be a hero, and with a good lawyer like pro-bono altruistic Melvin Belli be sure to get off for time served. Right. Oswald, Tippit, and Ruby all didn't know the difference between hero and patsified fall guy.
6- The other Oswald came in to the theater after Hungarian sacrificial Oswald, didn't pay, created that pretext, and hid upstairs. After Hungarian Oswald was taken out the front, and his arrest astonished the police radio dispatcher who expected Oswald to be dead, then upstairs Oswald was brought down to the police car in the back alley with a jacket over his head so people like the concession stand operator couldn't figure what was going on. He was hustled into a black and white and driven off. Soon to be released a block or two away where he was soon seen behind the wheel of PP4537 by mechanic T.F. White. Then he was flown to New Mexico in a CIA C-54 cargo plane along with Air Force Sergeant Robert Vinson. And a guy who looked a lot like David Sanchez Morales who was later eliminated when convenient with a double dose of ricin.
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7- Mark Groubert of America's Untold stories did a lot of leg work about the cast-off Oswald jacket tossed under a car. It turns out it had a laundry tag from a cleaning service in Larry Crafard's home base town in California. And he had bought an identical copy. It appears Westbrook was the one who went to the area to plant the jacket evidence.
What a movie this would make. No Hollywood screenwriter could make up a plot this complicated.
Or an epic miniseries. I’d love to help adapt the screenplay.
Pitch it to Netflix. It would be far better than most of their productions which are plagued by bad writing.
So it was the Hungarian Oswald who was the radar operator in Japan, who was the fake defector who spoke Russian like a native, befriended Titovets, and who returned to the US with Marina while the real Oswald stayed in New Orleans training anti-Castro Cuban fighters and ordering military hardware for them?
Wasn't the body in Oswald's grave exhumed and verified to be that of the real LHO?
Groubert theorizes that Craferd and Ruby killed Tippit, thus the two types of shells found at the scene and confiscated by the FBI.
That's a very pertinent question. I read up on this issue and found a few facts that cast doubt on the official version of the exhumation. I did a Quora post about it here:
https://qr.ae/prsCG0
Thanks! Great work.
There might (should) be some tissue saved from the autopsy. If so, this controversy could be resolved by DNA. I say this after watching many hours of Bloodline Detectives where decades old murders have been solved in the last few years through genetic genealogy. I think one unknown murder victim was identified after 50 or 60 years because tissue had been saved from the victim's autopsy (on a slide, I think).
Robert Oswald went along with this imposter project? Why would he do so?
I don’t know. Maybe he knew his real brother was alive and working undercover, and he was incentivized to go along with the gag. It does seem far-fetched, but it resonates at the same time.
Oliver Stone should make this movie.
I've always thought David Lynch could do a great take on this. He's got a thing for doppelgängers. They appear in at least 3 of his movies plus the Twin Peaks series.
Come to think of it, it's less far-fetched than MK-Ultra.
The fake Hungarian Oswald and his fake Marguerite mother moved in to 101 San Saba in Benbrook, Texas on July 7, 1947. They were installed about 4 blocks from the real Oswalds, and their jobs were to teach the fakes how to be Oswalds and for the fakes the job was to learn how to be Oswalds. Both sets moved in parallel to New York and New Orleans at various times, and it was all about cultivating the Hungarian as a twin. The fake mama had more of a New York accent than a New Orleans accent, where she supposedly was from. Robert was in on the deal from the beginning, and ultimately lined up the Hungarian to be sacrificed to the deep state machine.
Why these arrangements? Most likely because all these people got aventurous exciting jobs and were paid to do what they enjoyed doing. The adult Hungarian Oswald fakers under another name most likely came from anti-communist stock fleeing the Red Army at the end of WWII. So the father and uncle were paid to be pretend commies and spy for the US Government when they got to the Connecticut-New York area. Son Lee from Hungary bought into that flavor of patriotism and related pride, so he was on board mentally with the CIA since he was about kindergarten age. The Oswald born in New Orleans had a family military background including John Pic the half-brother and Robert the brother. So, when such a person is told he has the chance to be a real-life James Bond, earn money outsmarting the bad guys, and puff his head among the elite, few would say no.
He just didn't figure out until late in the game that he was on the list of expendables. Like Dee Dee Myers left Clinton's White House not realizing there was a Raven Rock nuclear bunker to go to but she wasn't on that invite list. Robert was selling out the Hungarian, not his flesh and blood. I highly doubt the real Oswald was killed and put in the casket. They had to keep the real Oswald alive to keep brother Robert happy and quiet, and he didn't die until 2017. Plus, to the select elites, seeing the real Oswald around your CIA spook retirement community in Paraguay means the CIA supervisors are trustworthy honorable people, and you can recommend the spy game to your children and grandchildren, with all the camaraderie and esprit de corps of more generations of heroic patriotic achievement. Which is also probably why Ruth Paine was never fed to the wolves.
We know they ginned up the Ralph Yates pickup truck ride to frame Oswald. Then they decided it was unneeded overkill, so Yates was locked up in the nuthouse and died young. There was all the trouble to frame Oswald in Mexico City, and then LBJ didn't want an extra war in Cuba or Russia. So that extra story was quashed. We know the body exhumed in 1981 wasn't the Hungarian Oswald, because the skull was intact. We know it wasn't the New Orleans Oswald because the teeth were intact. So what? To the CIA getting hold of a third corpse is a piece of cake. They just bungled the job, like they bungled a shot from the front into penetrating the windshield, or like they bungled and left behind on sixth floor a Mauser instead of a Mannlicher-Carcano. We already know from Ralph Yates and Robert Vinson and T.F. White and a dozen other doppelganger citings that there were multiple Oswalds. Another episode underground with embalming fluid is just par for the course.
Was it the Hungarian Oswald who was the radar operator in Japan, who was the fake defector who spoke Russian like a native, befriended Titovets, and who returned to the US with Marina while the real Oswald stayed in New Orleans training anti-Castro Cuban fighters and ordering military hardware for them?
Was Marina in on the whole thing? Was she sleeping with both the real Oswald and the Hungarian Oswald?
She would know one from the other, right?
Yes, after Hungarian Oswald and Roscoe White finished up their false flag training at the School of Illusionary Warfare near Nag's Head NC, they were on the same boat to Japan. Oswald stayed at Atsugi and Roscoe went on to the Philippines. Yes re Russian skills, Titovets, and marrying Marina. The two Oswalds were in southern California simultaneously in the Marines, but at different bases. The real Oswald would likely help with the Cuban exile training in Louisiana but I haven't read about that. For the Nov. 2 plot in Chicago, Thomas Arthur Vallee had a New York plates car registered to Lee Harvey Oswald, so chances are the American Oswald spent time in New York working with Cuban exiles.
I doubt Marina knew anything. Considering their marital strife the CIA would have screened that out ahead of time and regarded her as too much of a security risk to be brought into the spy game. So Marina is likely random noise. Notice that in 1965 she married Porter, an employee of Collins Radio, and the probability is that he was assigned to watch her as a loose cannon unknown and thus requiring ongoing observation. Collins also provided a raiding boat called the Rex to the CIA for dropping exile teams on Cuban shores. Their Carl Mather lived in the same neighborhood as Tippit with Roscoe White watching him from across the street. Carl Mather had put Collins radios and navigation equipment aboard LBJ's Air Force Two, so he was a team player. After American Oswald was taken out the back of the theater to be smuggled away, T.F. White saw the American Oswald behind the wheel of Mather's car PP4537. Collins radios on loan from Jack Crichton's 488th Military Intelligence Detachment were likely used for their secret frequency hopping features to coordinate chess moves on Nov. 22.
Such as announcing Tippit's ambush death via Dal-Tex to sixth floor TSBD, so they knew it was time to roll pretext cops to Oak Cliff so they next could be sent to the Texas Theater over a big deal ticket unpaid by the real Oswald. He walked in without paying and hid upstairs in the mezzanine. Specifically, when Tippit was shot most people ran away and a few ran towards, to help. Meanwhile one peculiar guy stood there watching from across the street. Only when Tippit got his coup de grace shot to the head did the passive observer walk calmly away. To PP4537, probably to call in Tippit's death on schedule io the cops waiting for it in TSBD. The radio message would have gone first to Assassination Command Central in Zapruder's offices at fourth floor Dal-Tex, then relayed across the street to TSBD by hand signals. Helen Markham on her way to work knew Tippit was shot at 1:06pm. Roger Craig at sixth floor TSBD heard about Tippit being shot at 1:06pm. No cell phones then and no wall phones at sixth floor TSBD, so radio relayed messaging must have been how the news got so fast from Tippit's ambush to the cops being told to roll to Oak Cliff.
Between 11am and noon, Zapruder was walking around his office space encouraging "Everybody out, everybody out! We all have a presidential parade to go see! Everybody out!" Other than one selected secretary (his Jeanne LeGon had been married to George de Mohrenschildt in 1959) everybody was out by 11:45am. Dal-Tex offices were perfect to film JFK coming around the Main St. corner onto Houston, full frontal filming all the way down Houston, the lazy turn onto Elm with JFK on the Dal-Tex side of the camera work, and then his exit down Elm. Twice as much film as what Zapruder got by balancing on a pedestal, held up by a secretary so he didn't lose his balance and break his neck. He was there to film an assassination, not a presidential visit. Babushka Lady was across the street in case his camera needed backing up. It didn't, so this CIA operative not there for fame or fortune deposited her version with the Green Beret sniper assassination training class at Ft. Bragg NC. There is was seen by Dan Marvin and his training class. Once over and the lights came up, the instructor said, "This is an excellent example of how to conduct a perfect urban sniper assassination." Later the CIA at Ft. Bragg asked Dan Marvin to kill Lt. Cmdr. William Bruce Pitzer. Because he had a complete and untampered video of the faked JFK autopsy, and it could not see the light of day. Nor the blackmail the admirals were doing to autopsy doctors Humes and Boswell. Marvin refused to kill Pitzer, so somebody else did.
The 488th was under Jack Crichton, who needed JFK and Castro dead so he could resume big oil operations in the eastern half of Cuba. The real Oswald was reputedly homosexual and therefore fit right in behind the scenes at Jack Ruby's Carousel Club with George Senator, Larry Crafard, Jack Lawrence, and all the rest. So Marina would hardly be two-timing the one Oswald with the other. She had been date-raped back in Russia before meeting LHO, and for some reason didn't seem to be a hard-core floozy. Just a girlfriend of Oswald and an occasional other CIA plant. Of course Marina would be able to tell the two Oswalds apart, but I would guess she wasn't told about the second Oswald so that she couldn't leak the information in case she was from the KGB. One Oswald had blue eyes, the other brown. One was left-handed, the other right-handed. At Beauregard Jr High School Ed Voebel knew both but had no clue he was facing two different Oswalds at the same school. But he must have remembered some discrepancy and started talking about it, because he died at age 31 in 1971 after getting sick (aided or unaided) and going to the Ochsner Clinic.
As to Tippit, remember that Earlene Roberts looked out from the Beckley rooming house and saw two cops in the car when they tapped the horn twice for Oswald. Tippit hadn't been able to pick up Oswald at the Gloco gas station when he changed plans, and when Tippit heard from Westbrook Oswald wasn't on the bus he rushed to the record store only to not connect. That probably was when Earlene Roberts got the call from a friend to turn on her TV for the JFK news. Still in his big panic, Tippit must have gone directly to Beckley to get Hungarian Oswald, and picked him up for the trip to the theater from the Zangs bus-stop across the street.
Then there's the stray police shirt tossed in the back of Tippit's car. Found after he was taken to Methodist Hospital to be pronounced dead. It starts to sound like Tippit's companion was actually a civilian with a cop shirt on for appearances' sake. If you are a hit planner and you don't know where Oswald will end up, but you do know Tippit will be sent (he thinks) to kill Oswald for the fame and book deals, you need an agent of death with Tippit while he is driving around. So that if Oswald bolts and runs and Tippit can track him down, why as soon as sucker cop gets close the magic code words come over the radio. That way the guy wearing the cop shirt can blow away Tippit on a customized job to order basis.
It only happens near Oswald, Tippit's death anywhere is the pretext to fetch cops out of Dealey Plaza since a missing doggie or late library book won't do. And a guy looking like Oswald with Hungarian Oswald near makes it easy to screw the patsy. What a deal we have for you! So there is a fair chance Tippit and his friend dropped Oswald off near the theater, then went to Tenth and Patton for last-minute instructions from Westbrook about blowing away Oswald back at the theater. All Tippit had to do was drop the guy off half a block away from Tenth and Patton, he would walk the short distance to Westbrook's car for a ride back downtown, and everything would be fine for Tippit's pending performance. They just didn't tell him what it would really be.
I definitely buy the Craford/Ruby responsibility for the Tippit shooting based on the Mark Groubert research which also is consistent with great witness Acquilla Clemons. I don’t know what to make of the Lee and Harvey storyline. Clearly there were numerous impersonations but the complexity of the Hungarian Oswald and Marguerite and which family members knew and how the LHO arrest played out seems too complex to be believed. Sure would be nice if there were not so many mysteries/holes surrounding LHO’s movements following the assassination or of the infamous Mexico City trip. I’m anxious with anticipation we could learn something new in the near future.
Does anyone know if there is any truth to the rumor that photos exist of Curtis Laverne “Larry” Craford (friend/employee of Jack Ruby who fled Dallas post assassination, allegedly saying they weren’t going to pin the assssination on him) wearing that lighter colored Eisenhower-style jacket? I believe people have considered him to be a suspect in the Tippett murder along with Ruby, but I can’t find the images. Could be nonsense but curious if anyone has ever looked into it? I believe I also read the Los Angeles-based dry cleaner receipt found in the jacket points to him as he had lived in LA? Any info or thoughts would be appreciated!
Covered by Mark Groubert in a segment of America's Untold Stories on YouTube.
Thank you!!!
-------------- List of 30 Bullets Fired in Dealey Plaza on Nov. 22, 1963 ----------------
Mostly with silencer rifles, JFK hit three times from front and three times from rear
01- Z143 to pavement in front of Phil Willis, commence fire shot
02- Z155 to pavement at left rear of limousine, commence fire confirmation shot with colored sparks
03- Z206 to JFK right shoulder, in 1.25 inches, fell out on Jerrol Custer x-ray exam table, underpowered
04- Z220 to JFK throat via windshield from southern grassy knoll, intended for head, underpowered
05- Z250 to area of external occipital protuberance, ended right of vomer bone, underpowered
06- Z286 to upper right forehead from storm sewer drain, exit visible on quality Moorman photo at cowlick
07- Z313 Harry Weatherford shot from Central Records, in back of head out as right temple flap wound
08- Z342 In at right temple, out at site of Z313 exit obliterating it. Trick shot leaving one hole from 2 shooters
--------- prior shots in time sequence, following shots at unclear exact times ---------------
09- hit windshield rim above and left of Kellerman's head. CE399 is fake substitute for Sam Kinney bullet
10- found by Jesse Curry slightly south of south curb in grass, angle suggests another commence fire shot
11, 12- into Connally from third man on sixth floor, from west end of TSBD. There was no lone sniper
13- Harry Weatherford shot from Central Records to concrete pad near manhole cover south of grassy knoll
14- bullet stolen by Deputy Buddy Walthers for his own personal curiosity
15- Jean Hill bullet hitting grass at her feet, as related to her by Secret Service
16- another colored pyrotechnic signal shot, this time for cease-fire at grassy knoll, but largely ignored
17, 18, 19- and maybe more past heads of Jean Hill and Mary Moorman, standing near yellow curb mark
20,21- and probably more past head of Malcolm Summers as he dove for the grass
22- ricochet off curb into right cheek of James Tague
23- found in limousine night of Nov. 22 by Mills & Martinelli of the James Young crew, d
24, 25, 26- shell casing found later on roof of Central Records Building under A/C, bullets on several roofs
27, 28, 29, 30- impacts heard by Malcolm Summers and Roy Kellerman (WCR 2:66) slamming inside limo
31- gouge into sidewalk west of book depository covered by police car Nov. 22, Penn Jones, Robt Groden
32- embedded in bubble top arch = holder in front of Connallys, Arlo Childers at Hess and Eisenhart repairs
33- stretcher bullet as JFK entered Parkland halfway between earlobe and shoulder, nurse Phyllis J. Hall
xx- fake = Paul Landis claimed loose bullet on seatback top. If true would require second hole in JFK shirt
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Off-topic. A new interview with a USS Liberty survivor was just posted on Redacted. This incident shares a lot in common with the JFK assassination in terms of secrecy and coverup except a lot of the people are still alive. No Congress has had the courage to even open an investigation. Why? Maybe for the same reasons the CIA won't release the JFKA papers. It might reveal who really controls the country.
https://youtu.be/cos1l5YeCy8?si=Xw1UYnb94SOIPo2f
When I first heard this story, I thought it was the pinnacle of tinfoil hat theories. The more I read about it, the more credible it becomes.
Who goes to a rifle range, makes a conspicuous ass of himself and then announces himself using first, middle, and last names? Who introduces themselves by their full name? No one.
Is it the same person in the two photos at the top of the article?
I don't think the original theory is correct in all details. For example, IIRC, the.body buried in Oswald's grave was exhumed for identity purposes, and it was confirmed that the corpse was that of the real Lee Harvey Oswald. In other words, hasn't it already been proven that the real LHO was murdered by Ruby, not the imposter?